It is a fantastic image. I like the detail in the skyline background. The rocks in the forefront I feel should have a little more shades of gray. I see no problems with sky replacement if you're replacing it with it with your original image. AI improvement I never use, I prefer my own ideas and the results of my creativity.   Posted: 07/04/2025 21:09:03

Hi Rick. In general, the ability of AI, Generative AI, or other means to digitally manipulate and create images gives rise to two dilemmas - that of deciding what is "allowable" in different contexts (e.g., our group, various contests, social media, etc.), and that of determining when people are breaking the established rules. The latter dilemma is a case of the larger problem of "fake news" - lots of smart people are working on solutions to that and hopefully they are making progress. But for us here in the group I think this latter problem is irrelevant because I would argue most everything should be allowable.

My perspective is that this is a learning space not a competition. And, as a learning space, I think most anything is acceptable in the interest of learning. Case in point, if someone thought their composition was not quite working and wanted to "change a few things" with generative AI for the purpose of better understanding what was throwing off the composition, I don't see a problem with that. I'd hope they would admit to it - perhaps even provide both before and after - and ask the group if indeed it fixed things. You may recall that I did exactly this sort of thing with a tree image from Owens Valley some months ago. I'd never enter the modified image in a competition. It was already dead to me as a portfolio image. But it was still useful as a learning opportunity.

Furthermore, I'd say that outside of the group many (indeed most) photography competitions allow a high degree of digital manipulation including cloning out objects, composting, focal length blends, time blends, sky replacement, warping and distortions, etc. If we want to help people learn and improve toward submission in these sorts of competitions, why would we not allow the same? And indeed, based on my history with the group over a bunch of years, I've seen most of these sorts of manipulations submitted by others (and a couple of times by me) - and I'm only counting the ones where people admitted to it.

Finally, were we (or PSA) to decide to limit things in the group, I would caution that intent and semantics are two separate things. Many tools that folks have used for years with far less controversy have AI behind them. As you are no doubt aware, if you use the clone tool in PS to remove a sensor spot you are using AI. Few would question the appropriateness of that. In contrast, say "Generative AI", and now there is a debate. To me whether that debate is warranted or not depends on what one is doing with the Generative AI tool. Case in point, not too long ago when I was first working with a "new to me" used camera, I captured a once in a lifetime image only to find it had the mother of all sensor spots. Shame on me for not cleaning the sensor before using it. I tried the clone tool, but it wasn't working. I tried context aware fill, but it wasn't working. So, desperate, I tried generative AI fill and told it to basically clone out the sensor spot. That worked like a champ. So, my point is, if there is going to be a discussion or debate, it ought to be around what one is doing to the image, not what tool is used to do that and whether it has AI or generative AI in the name.
  Posted: 07/12/2025 19:10:43

Hi Rick, a VERY interesting image of a skyline that is only about 90 min away. It's great to see a newer take on an already beautiful view. Just a couple of notes. There seems to be a lot of banding in the sky. I'm not sure if it is a function of the stretching process, an artifact of a smaller file size, or an artistic choice. In any event, I think it is a bit distracting. I also found the color choice interesting for the foreground, as they seem quite purple(?), which I assume they are not in actuality. Was this an artistic choice? I'm not sure if I like it or not (certainly just a personal choice on my part). I do like the rock in the foreground however, as they create balance especially the rocks on the right side of the image balancing the Bay Bridge. A bit of an older image too, since the Salesforce building is under construction in the image.   Posted: 07/25/2025 17:45:38

I really don't know how to comment on this. That being said I will appreciate the aesthetics choices for the image. The picture as such is a beautiful one.   Posted: 07/27/2025 23:03:14